2022 Regulatory Overhaul (a.k.a. Project Death to Dirty Air/DRS-free Overtaking)

Started by Penfold, April 06, 2018, 01:57:58 AM

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Penfold

... but of course if a smaller team does a cracking job on limited resources one year, they themselves will then be restricted for the following season.

"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Chrill

Indeed. This only really works as long as there is a lot of carryover from season to season. For every new set of aerodynamic regulations, they would have to reset the penalties.

I'm definitely more keen on continuing to lower the budget cap, or indeed to include more costs within it.
"It is becoming apparent Ericsson is not, after all, joining Ferrari Ganassi for 2019 2020."
- Chrill, 28 Sep 2018 8 Oct 2019

Penfold

"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Chrill

Still no word on the removal of DRS?

As far as I remember, they said that DRS will stay on cars but that they may not include DRS zones on some weekends? That sounded vague, I was expecting a clearer decision.
"It is becoming apparent Ericsson is not, after all, joining Ferrari Ganassi for 2019 2020."
- Chrill, 28 Sep 2018 8 Oct 2019

Penfold

Using DRS in '22 and beyond would be the final straw for me - I've not actually missed F1 very much this year anyway.
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Matt

They've fully invested on including DRS in F2 and F3 at this point, and the influx of new fans since the Netflix series doesn't care about it or know anything different. I don't think they'll ever get rid of it.

DTM is even worse, where they have DRS and push-to-pass, and each are limited to a certain number of uses. But DTM will be dead in three months anyway.

Penfold

Yes, goodbye Audi.  Always that risk when you rely on manufacturers who use racing as a PR side project rather than on teams who exist for no purpose but to go racing, and that's a good reason for introducing F1's budget cap and making it a profitable enterprise for people like Mercedes & Renault.

As for DRS... cars in '22 should be able to follow through corners quite closely, so can you imagine how early down the straight a DRS pass would be completed?
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Chrill

Since they define the DRS zones for every Grand Prix, I reckon we'll learn about the need of DRS in 2022's pre-season. If it turns out the cars can follow each other pretty closely indeed, the DRS zone may simply be skipped for certain races where it is no longer needed, but perhaps the Monaco GP would still use it down the Start/Finish "straight" and in similar tight locations where overtaking is nigh impossible.
"It is becoming apparent Ericsson is not, after all, joining Ferrari Ganassi for 2019 2020."
- Chrill, 28 Sep 2018 8 Oct 2019

Matt

Because the top-side aero will be less important, which is what will make following closely easier to begin with, DRS will naturally become less effective anyway. The rear wing won't be creating as much downforce or causing as much drag.

I just don't think they're going to get rid of it anywhere. Shorten the zones, maybe, but many of the zones are already too long and they don't seem to have much urgency to fix them.

Penfold

In my mind, I'm imagining DRS on a '22 car as being comparable to using it in Monza right now - with the proviso that the chaser could be tucked up closer heading into any activation zone.

I'm still optimistic that DRS won't be used with the new cars, F1 has put a lot into this aero overhaul - this & the budget cap are central to the new, fitter, leaner F1 - and I can't see the logic in persisting with this wing gimmick.  Okay, perhaps an argument could be made that a select few tracks would still 'benefit' from DRS, places like Budapest & Melbourne, but for the vast majority of venues it would make an absolute farce not only of the effort expended by Brawn's design team, but of the decision to force F1 teams to fundamentally redesign their cars.

Aero not such an issue in F2 or F3 - truly depressing that they pushed DRS on to the lower forumlae where drivers learn their craft - but presumably in time aspects of the new F1 philosophy will filter down the ranks.
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Chrill

By 2025, Pat Symonds is looking at two initiatives to reduce weight. That's about time!

https://www.racefans.net/2021/04/07/f1-planning-new-active-aero-for-2025-cars-to-slash-fuel-consumption/

1. Synthetic fuels with more energy per kilogram, effectively requiring less fuel for a race distance. This would reduce car weight by up to 75 kgs at the start of races, and 5ish kgs during qualifying runs
2. Active aero (think DRS) permanently in use in straights to reduce drag. If everyone including the defender uses DRS when going straight, at least it's not an overtaking gimmick anymore and I'd be perfectly OK with that
"It is becoming apparent Ericsson is not, after all, joining Ferrari Ganassi for 2019 2020."
- Chrill, 28 Sep 2018 8 Oct 2019

Penfold

Quote from: Chrill on April 07, 2021, 12:54:50 AM
By 2025, Pat Symonds is looking at two initiatives to reduce weight. That's about time!
Cut down on the pies and take more exercise?
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Penfold

Synthetic fuels sound good, but active aero I'm a bit iffy about.  If it's used to shed drag on the straights, will a following car gain less from a tow relative to the car in front than they do now?
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)

Chrill

Quote from: Penfold on April 12, 2021, 05:12:19 AM
Cut down on the pies and take more exercise?
Confidence is a preference for the habitual voyeur of what is known as parklife.
"It is becoming apparent Ericsson is not, after all, joining Ferrari Ganassi for 2019 2020."
- Chrill, 28 Sep 2018 8 Oct 2019

Penfold

Crap, why didn't I say "cut down on his pork life and get some exercise"....
"I like beating and punching."
- Chrill (28/09/2018)