Formula 1 Circuits

[Penfold]

I mean, seriously, how is there not a topic discussing circuits?

I figured I needed a good place to discuss the Port Imperial Street Circuit (New Jersey/New York 2013) and a circuit topic would do it.

(Click for larger view)


What are your opinions? I mean, the start/finish straight is basically non-existant, see here:

This would run better in the other direction, that is counter-clockwise I guess. Still, seems like a lame copy of Monaco with wanted some fake Montreal effect. Dunno, dunno. Would have to see it raced, for better judgment. But it seems just too narrow, many slow corners, almost no straights, no fast corners. Or maybe I'm mistaken, the track is over 5 km long after all.

I still can't lose the Monaco impression, however. OK, chicane right after start is just plane stupid, than we have some corners like st.devote/la source/rascasse. Actually 3/4 is totally rascasse. 5-11 looks bit like Beau Rivage or maybe fake Eau Rouge into Kemmel complex. 13 is Massenet from Monaco. Then there's obvious standard trademark Tilke hairpin aka Loews. Followed by long "straight" like in Monaco, except without chicanes. Then 18/19 and 1/2 is again like Piscine in Monaco.
Of course Montreal also have those straight/chicane/hairpin things bundled.

You know my immediate thought on first sight of the track diagram was 'Detroit'; a circuit disturbingly familiar from too many hours on Geoff Crammond's epic F1 GP game.  Now that I've actually gone and grabbed an image of that long dead layout I see the New Jersey take as thankfully less stop-start and, as Ljud has elegantly covered, tilting heavily to Monaco & Montreal.

One thing, the 'straight' running from turn 15 to 18 must be at least 1km.  Anyone else find the proliferation of such lengthy strips of tarmac a little depressing?  Of the recent(ish) additions to the calendar we have Shanghai, Yas Marina, Yeongam, Buddh, and PISC (to abbreviate the New Jersey track name) each with a 1km plus straight - I guess this is where F1 finds itself, reduced to the 'long drag' to provide any possibility of overtaking.  Well, that and tyres that fall apart.   

Detroit layout as raced in the mid- to late-eighties:

I mean, seriously, how is there not a topic discussing circuits?

We're plainly terrible at this whole F1 forum thingy.

I think Tilke compared the PISC (I love the abbreviation) with Spa-Francorchamps, Montreal and Monaco all bundled into one. Which, be honest, SOUNDS amazing. It just, probably, isn't...

I'd rather see a Central Park race, shame that's not in the slightest possible

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/96412

2012 Brazilian Grand Prix will see a heavy revision of the final section, since two separate stock car accidents back in April both caused a fatality. Bigger pit entry, bigger run-off, generally more safe and modern final few corners. No major revisions for this weekend though.

So long as that fast, narrow section of track remains unchanged I'm all for the plan


Seeing as you (Mr. Chrill) went to the effort of forming this rather delightful F1 circuit-themed haven, t'would be rude not to use it.  With that in mind comes this news snippet/F1 track story... Germany's Speed Week reports that "leading representatives" of Mexico's motor racing federation are "very confident" an F1 race is viable, with the Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez in pole position as the venue.


And here's a photo of said circuit:

From what I've heard, a new circuit is to be built if Mexico gets the nod. A new race circuit, not some lame street circuit in Guadalajara as has also been reported.

Just what the World has been crying out for, an all new F1-specced race track.  Surely by now the planet has sufficient for at least two entire championships - quite useful were you planning a breakaway series.

I'd like to see a return to Imola. Shame it's in the wrong country. Had Imola been located in Abu Dhabi, I'd LOVE for F1 to go racing there.

New F1-spec track under construction in Argentina.  The Velociudad SpeedCity circuit lies approx 80km from Buenos Aires and is due for completion in early 2014; it will measure aprox. 4.7km and has been designed by Populous, the people behind Silverstone's recent revamp.

That's all I know.

In other words, not Tilke. HALLELUJAH

My first thoughts also.  Soon replaced with, ahh, I bet it won't host F1 anytime soon as Bernie's sights seem set on S. Africa and/or Mexico. Two more for Tilke?


French Govt. says plans to alternate a GP slot with Spa are "on track".  Le Figaro reports Paul Ricard in September 2013 will mark F1's return to France.

Also in 'track' news this fine (overcast) day:  Valencia's officials want a friendly chat with Bernie over reducing their race fee, which stands at 21 million Euros and runs until 2014.  Apparently Spain doesn't have a lot of cash right now... who knew?

The same goes for Circuit de Catalunya. They are "reconsidering" their continued participation in both Formula 1 and MotoGP.

Yep, bankruptcy all round.  So then, Bernie has suggested the two Spanish tracks alternating as a possible solution.  Which to me seemed likely quite some time ago.

Magny Cours battling it out with Paul Ricard to host the French GP in 2013.  Patrice Joly, president of the conseil general of the Nievre department, has said that a theme park proposed for Magny Cours could raise enough money and sufficiently develop the surrounding area in order to bring the grand prix back to the track.  Joly said the project, to cost EUR 50 million, would be completed by the summer.

Well, the problem with Magny-Cours never was the track, rather it was the rural setting. Build a goddamn city and we'll be fine.

Agree with you there, but sadly for the Magny-Cours people negotiations between Bernie and Paul Ricard's management are imminent: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/01/25/paul-ricard-set-to-host-2013-french-gp/

Two-into-one Spanish/European GP plan actively pursued by Valencia side: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/01/25/valencia-pushing-barcelona-for-f1-alternation/

I'd rather push for a new venue in Spain. Or for a move to Portuguese Estoril...

Portugal's economy is busy following Greece's into the abyss.  Sadly I don't see an Estoril revamp and handing $20 million/year to Bernie as a high priority for their Government.

[Penfold]

Aw damn. Let's just scrap Spain and party in Mexico in 2013 then. They all speak the same language anyway.

Except for the Portuguese. 

Barcelona chiefs have come out against the idea of race sharing.  I hope the guys in Valencia have a plan B up their sleeves.

I SAID SPAIN AND MEXICO, U F00L.

Also, I'd rather keep Barcelona and witness Valencia getting the f*** out of the F1 racing scene.

Oh crap.  Any more such howlers and you'll suspect I don't pay attention to your posts.

Agree with your Spanish track preference, Ljud.  Of course we have Valencia entering year two of a ten-year, $25 million/annum contract, with break fees of $50 million or more... poor dears can't afford to keep or cancel the race.  Perhaps they'll catch Bernie in a charitable mood and get their fee slashed.

Interlagos will be slightly revamped for 2013. The track itself won't change, but a new pit complex exclusively for Formula 1 will be built at what was formerly the straight after the start.

http://www.thef1times.com/news/display/05948#page_top

A chicane will be installed leading onto the "former" start/finish straight but most likely not used by Formula 1, thus rendering the F1 track exactly the same albeit starting at another place!!

Shifting the start/finish point will take some getting used to after all these years, but if that's what's needed to keep Interlagos as a viable F1 prospect then what the hell.


New Jersey circuit layout officially confirmed.  Start/finish line is located by the Hudson River ferry terminal (scenic!) and from there the track runs clockwise for a total of 3.2 miles - apparently with much undulation & shifts of camber along the way.  I maintain a stalwart belief that the configuration will allow for decent racing; rather wide image follows:




A return to Mexico is being pencilled in for next year, or so says one Spanish newspaper: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/05/30/mexico-to-host-grand-prix-return-in-2013/

On the old (but refurbished) Hermanos Rodriguez circuit no less:

I'd quite like that!! It seems both Russia and New Jersey will end up not making it, so why not?

I mean, Bernie makes comments similar to those surrounding Jersey about every new race.

Yeah, he's quite the kidder.  God knows how we'll cope when he's gone.

Montreal on cusp of new ten-year deal: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/06/13/montreal-close-to-new-long-term-f1-deal-says-ecclestone/

Great news as it's one of those tracks whose absence would diminish the sport.  At least for me.  One point though, Bernie clearly struggling with simple maths/memory as Europe has eight races not ten, and from next year seven - though only until the next one (Hungary?) disappears.


Thailand fancies having a GP: http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/thailand-eyes-2014-grand-prix-debut/

Well why not, a mere twenty races on the calendar at the moment so plenty of room for newcomers - New Jersey, Russia, Mexico, Argentina (aren't they borderline bankrupt?), Thailand... doubtless be another couple of hopefuls along shortly.

Bernie gives thumbs up to Interlagos redevelopment plan (first mentioned by Chrill in 10th May post): http://www.motorsport.com/#!/f1/news/ecclestone-approves-plan-to-move-interlagos-pits/

If we are to add five new races, we'll also have to lose five. Teams refuse more than 20 races a season. Rumours has it the Russian GP will be cancelled because they cannot financially pull off an F1 race the same year as the 2014 Winter Olympics. Perhaps Russia will have to wait to 2015 then...

Currently, no new tracks are confirmed for 2013. We actually "only" have 17 confirmed races for next season; all races from 2012 except Belgium, Japan, Europe (Valencia and Barcelona will alternate, starting with a Barcelona race in 2013) and Singapore, as well as the "Grand Prix of America" in New Jersey. We surely mustn't lose both Suzuka and Spa-Francorchamps... There is room to add three more according to the old Concorde Agreement, but there'll be a new one for 2013. I'm guessing Belgium (alternating with France??) and Japan will stay on, perhaps the 20th race will be Argentina, Thailand or Mexico.

I see us with twenty next year but only as I'm assuming Suzuka and Singapore will be with us (though I could happily lose the latter) and that the Franco-Belgian alternation commences with Paul Ricard.  If said assumptions are accurate then pressure to shed a track or two will hold until 2014, when Mexico and/or Thailand slide into the picture - does seem as if Russia will be ready later than first imagined.

So who to lose... Korea struggling to attract crowds/pay Bernie/build the promised city around the circuit.  I suspect their days are numbered.

Not a big lose, either. The only recently added track I like is the Buddh International in India. It's actually a pretty nifty piece of race track. Here's hoping Texas is even better. The start-finish straight ends in a steep incline before the first left hander.

Here's a work in progress of Codemaster's take on the Austin circuit as realized for F1 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3nK6Ch2lWc

Clearly they haven't got the speeds nailed yet as he tops out below 180 mph, but gives an idea of the track.


New French Govt. support GP return, but will it be Paul Ricard or Magny-Cours? http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/06/19/new-french-government-see-value-in-grand-prix/

Not exactly sure how this would work, but the Russian GP team is keen to incorporate the Winter Olympics stadium into their F1 track layout: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/06/19/sochi-eyes-olympic-stadium-for-russian-gp/

What, let the main straight run straight through, slap a sharp corner in the middle and hope for overtakes? Sure, sounds spectacular...

Yes, clearly the stadium is screaming out for one of Tilke's 'hairpin at end of massive straight' contraptions.  Just need to remove one of those end grandstands.  Can hardly wait....

Mexico next year? http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/06/21/mexico-working-on-2013-gp-return-says-billionaire-slim/

Don't get the reference to this mooted Mexican GP taking Valencia's 2013 slot, isn't New Jersey already doing that?

As far as I know, yes, New Jersey is doing that. Valencia and Barcelona is to alternate. France and Belgium too. I guess we will need to lose Singapore and South Korea

[Penfold]

Latest has it that Spa and Cours/Ricard likely won't be sharing a race slot, and that any French GP will have to stand on its own two feet (i.e. no State support): http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/06/28/spa-will-not-alternate-with-french-gp/

Meanwhile... Bernie adds yet another entrant to the ever-growing list of would-be race hosts, this time London: http://www.itv.com/news/2012-06-28/f1-boss-bernie-ecclestone-offers-millions-to-hold-london-street-grand-prix/

That confirms no French GP then

Meanwhile... Bernie adds yet another entrant to the ever-growing list of would-be race hosts, this time London: http://www.itv.com/news/2012-06-28/f1-boss-bernie-ecclestone-offers-millions-to-hold-london-street-grand-prix/

Yes, I heard something about Ecclestone actually willing to fund the race.

Good news!  Agreement in principle for three year contract extension at Spa: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/07/09/new-three-year-grand-prix-deal-for-spa-francorchamps-confirmed/

Didn't they announce that a few weeks back? I remember having heard something like "no, we wont alternate with France, we will host a race every year until at least 2015"

Hmm, think that was just an ambition at the time... now they (almost) have a contract with Bernie.  One step closer.

In other circuit news: Singapore has yet to extend its deal beyond 2012; race organizers attempting to negotiate a reduction in current $40 million/year payments.  Personally I hope they can't come to an agreement with Mr. E as I very much dislike the Singapore GP.

I don't mind the Singapore GP nearly as much as you do, but I still agree. It is one of the tracks I'd wanna see go away and be replaced by, I dunno, CotA?

Unfortunately seems as though a new five-year deal has been agreed between Bernie and the Singaporeans.  Oh well, perhaps the race will 'do a Valencia' with a sudden, and entirely unexpected drastic improvement in quality/excitement.

Sure, the Valencia GP was a good one this year but that's entirely down to DNFs. Had Vettel not broken down, it would have been a runaway victory.

True, Seb V. was waltzing it.  Still, much more overtaking through the field (not one of those grass covered expanses) than in previous events... at least I think there was.  It's surely the first time I didn't come near to nodding off during a Valencia GP, which I guess counts for something.

I am guessing this is the place to do a little summary on the 2013 circuits!

The calendar for 2013 has still not been released (the one for 2012 was released back in early July 2011, so we're already two months late!) because of negotiation issues. However, they aim to run a 20-race calendar in 2013. 18 races are already confirmed:

1. Yas Marina, Abu Dhabi
2. Port Imperial, New Jersey NEW
3. Albert Park, Melbourne, Australia
4. Sakhir, Bahrain
5. Spa-Francorchamps, Belgium
6. Interlagos, São Paulo, Brazil
7. Silverstone, UK
8. Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, Montreal, Canada
9. Shanghai, China
10. Nürburgring, Germany Alternating with Hockenheim, Germany
11. Hungaroring, Hungary
12. Buddh International, India
13. Monza, Italy
14. Yeongam, South Korea
15. Sepang, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
16. Monte Carlo, Monaco
17. Circuit de Catalunya, Spain Alternating with Valencia Street Circuit, Spain
18. Circuit of the Americas, Austin, TX


2012 tracks NOT currently signed for 2013:
19. Suzuka Circuit, Japan
20. Marina Bay, Singapore


Japan and Singapore are supposedly expected to stay on for 2013 but are not yet confirmed.

Tracks that could potentially take their place already in 2013 are:
Magny-Cours, France
Paul Ricard, France
Istanbul, Turkey


Other proposals that are not confirmed for 2013, but might be on the table for 2014 (or later):
Mar de Plata, Argentina
London Street Circuit, UK
Rome Street Circuit, Italy
Sochi, Russia

Mexico as possible 2014/15 addition?

Last I read on Sochi was that they are still determined to make the 2014 calendar, and yet the circuits which one may consider to have questionable long-term commitment to F1 (due to size of hosting fee and/or lacklustre national interest) all seem to have contracts extending to 2015 or later.  So to squeeze in Russia any earlier (assuming constant 20 race schedule) will compel Bernie to agree an early termination deal with the... Chinese, Bahrainis, Malaysians, South Koreans (though just agreed a fee cut for them so seems unlikely), Hungarians???

Interesting to see who drops out, unless of course the calendar grows yet fatter.

Edit: Magny-Cours asks to be considered for inclusion on the 2013 calendar, Paul Ricard to follow suit next week: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/09/05/magny-cours-applies-for-date-on-2013-calendar/

Now all they need is to arrange the little matter of Bernie's fee, and to convince him they can keep the money coming throughout a multi-year contract.  Simple.

With 18 races confirmed, I am afraid we will lose Suzuka if they try to fit in more races. We shall see who gets confirmed first; Suzuka or Singapore.

Losing Suzuka would be a bitter blow; one more nail in the coffin of my F1 enjoyment.

With 18 races confirmed, I am afraid we will lose Suzuka if they try to fit in more races. We shall see who gets confirmed first; Suzuka or Singapore.

That would be Singapore then, with a contract extension taking them through to 2017.  Something along those lines for Suzuka would be most welcome.

Well now, Suzuka was included in the list for 2013 tracks. All good.

The next country to apply for an F1 race may be European once more! Advanced plans for a proper motor racing in Wales are in motion. Primarily the track would aim for other series than F1 but it would indeed be "up to it" as far as safety standards go.
http://www.gpupdate.net/en/motogp-news/284576/circuit-of-wales-to-submit-planni

Even if the racing only ever involves bikes and lower series cars, the project will provide a welcome economic boost to the area; and as the proposed site is within an industrial estate one would hope commercial motorsport entities could be enticed to set-up shop.


More on possibility of French GP; Aussies want a fee cut; and Thailand push for a race in 2014: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/09/27/french-gp-could-happen-as-thailand-strike-f1-deal/

Great, another bloody street race on the calendar.  And who gets canned to squeeze in this one?

Also;
South Africa
France
Mexico
Argentina

Lots of countries want in. Rumours has it Nürburgring won't host another F1 race. That would put Hockenheim back at hosting races every year. Which they cannot afford. THEREFORE, rumours has it that Hockenheim will attempt to join the Paul Ricard Circuit in alternating, the French track in 2013, 2015, 2017 and the German in 2014 and 2016.

... and not forgetting Russia in 2014.  Though I reckon Argentina can be ruled out, somehow I just don't see them having the cash to convince Bernie that a race is viable - the same may well be true of S. Africa.


Greeks ploughing on with their F1-standard circuit: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/10/02/greek-government-to-subsidise-f1-track/

Nice 30 million Euro subsidy from the (bankrupt) Govt.  One might suggest that any spare money be directed towards Greece's overwhelmed soup kitchens or earmarked for replenishing depleted hospital supplies, and perhaps leave the, almost certainly loss-making, race track for another day.  If you are going to subsidize something, at least pick ventures with a high likelihood of profitability and significant long-term job creation... mind you, who would be crazy enough to invest in Greece before the Euro crisis is resolved?

[Penfold]

I'd rather see the Euro dissolved. It's doing no good to any of the countries. Sweden is doing far better without it. The UK would be doing far worse with the Euro. We are all lucky not to use the Euro. The Germans, the Finns and the Greeks are reportedly all looking into reverting to their former currencies (the German mark, the Finnish markka and the Greek drachma). Supposedly the Finns are furthest along the path of actually making it an official proposal. Sweden is clearly not going to join the Euro judging from what has happened these last few years.

Now, F1!

Fairly sure you'll get your Euro break-up wish, all just a question of how long the populace of various troubled nations tolerate mass unemployment.  Actually the best solution would entail Germany and a few like-minded pals forming a new 'hard currency' grouping and let France & Italy take the reins of the Euro - which would then quickly drop in value.  This at least would keep all those pesky debts in Euros rather than Greece, Spain, etc having to either re-base them into Drachmas, Pesetas, etc, or attempt to fund existing Euro debts with their new (old) devalued currencies.  All this is far too sensible and counter to the grand European Project so of course it will never happen.  Instead we'll get a right bloody mess.

Just as a side note (then no more on the issue), the U.K.'s Liberal Democrats, who are currently in coalition with Conservatives, still believe it is in our long-term interest to join the Euro.  And still people vote for them...


Another wannabe to add to the list: Qatar.  Pushing for an F1 licence for their Losail circuit, with a view to initially hosting pre-season testing but eventually a GP: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/10/22/qatar-pushing-for-f1-testing-and-targets-grand-prix/

Wow, I'm so excited by this prospect I might just explode.

Oh yes, I'd absolutely love some more Middle Eastern flavour to our race series. The mighty Qatar will also be hosting the 2022 World Cup. Good country, that.

Did I mention that Qatar is about the same size as Yorkshire and with a citizen number well below the city of Bristol? About 30% of the Qatari population (1.5 million) are citizens of Qatar. The other 70% are foreigners working there.

Oh yes, the (won fair and square) 2022 World Cup... because who wouldn't want to visit a desert state in the height of summer?

Thailand has agreed a deal in principle for a night race (whoopie) to be run round the streets (oh great) of Bangkok from 2014 and on.

Rumours has it France has indeed been offered to replace New Jersey for 2013. Paul Ricard or Magny-Cours are touted as the most likely options. If funding is in place, Ecclestone claims he is ready to sign.

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/93088.html?CMP=OTC-RSS

Read somewhere, could be even on here, can't recall, that Red Bull is pushing for the New Jersey race and are ready to make a significant contribution financially to organize the race there in 2013.

Bernie did suggest that Dietrich whatshisface (owner of Red Bull) should consider stepping in to save the event for 2013, but I haven't read anything on Herr Red Bull's willingness to actually put hand in pocket and toss the resulting coinage New Jersey's way.  If Dietrich doesn't save the day, I assume Paul Ricard (owned by a certain Mr. Ecclestone) must be favourite as a last-minute replacement.


Bernie's keen (if the money's right) for Istanbul to return to the F1 family.  Good track so happy to see it back, but presumably same issue with low attendance would persist and so then bankruptcy for track owner ensues.

That Marko chap from Red Bull suggested the A1-Ring (now Red Bull Ring) could one day again host F1.  All depends whether spaces open up on the calendar due to venues such as Korea being unable/unwilling to continue absorbing huge annual losses.

I've heard it's a race to the money between Austria and Turkey for race 20. Personally, I'd rather see Austria just because it's been a while. Turkey isn't so bad, but it's just like any new track.

The A1-Ring was always one of my favourites on the old F1 racing games (of course the games weren't old at the time...).


Revised 2013 calendar:

17/03 Australia
24/03 Malaysia
14/04 China
21/04 Bahrain
12/05 Spain
26/05 Monaco
09/06 Canada
30/06 United Kingdom
07/07 Germany
21/07 Reserved for another European event*
28/07 Hungary
25/08 Belgium
08/09 Italy
22/09 Singapore
06/10 Korea
13/10 Japan
27/10 India
03/11 Abu Dhabi
17/11 U.S.A.
24/11 Brazil

*Subject to approval of the relevant national sporting authorities

I'D LOVE IMOLA BACK THOUGH. OK.

If only.  Austria seems top of the pile now the Turkish Govt. has refused to financially support Istanbul, with France as an outside possibility.

So, there are two Red Bull teams in F1, one of them world champion from 2011 to 2013, and now a circuit too? At least the Red Bull Ring won't be all that suitable for Red Bull. It doesn't play to their strengths!

Barcelona wants race slot all to its self: http://www.yallaf1.com/2012/12/19/barcelona-not-intersted-in-valencia-alternation-option/

Thailand night race possible in 2015: http://www.crash.net/f1/news/186916/1/thailand_set_for_2015_f1_debut.html

Yes! Another street race comprising 20-odd low-speed corners for drivers to accelerate/decelerate in between.  I can hardly wait.

YAAAY MORE TRACKS LIKE ABU DHABI, SINGAPORE AND BAHRAIN. AWESOMENESS.

Mexico in push for 2014 GP: http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/289552/mexico-targets-return-to-calendar-in-2014/

Well, would be a superior choice than most (all?) of the recent additions.


Next year's Russian GP will get a November slot, according to the Mayor of Sochi.

Valencia track/streets used for circuit have rapidly fallen into a state of disrepair, making F1's return to the venue unlikely.

Der Spiegel asserts that Bernie has told the Nurburgring that they will not be hosting this year's German GP; meaning we get the even more tedious Hockenheim circuit - not that I'll be watching as it's a SKY exclusive.

Edit: Forgot to mention that Bernie has proposed the Algarve International Circuit as a possible venue for round ten of the 2013 Championship.  I think it's basically that or somewhere in France, with the latter option still in the lead.

With Nürburgring out, what I have heard is we will have no German Grand Prix at all, possibly reducing the calendar to 18 races... JUST BRING IN THE RED BULL RING, IMOLA, ALGARVE, PAUL RICARD, MAGNY-COURS, ZANDVOORT OR ISTANBUL PARK!!!! It's not like there is a lack of circuits capable of hosting F1 races.

[Penfold]

There's only a shortage of Bernie-approved venues.

Six weeks from season opener and the calendar is not yet finalized, one of the teams is in limbo, and several driver spots remain unconfirmed.  All seems quite unusual, or perhaps not and I've simply erased such pre-season shenanigans from my memory?


... and now Nurburgring has been confirmed as the location of this year's German GP.  Just need to sort the July 21st slot.


No we don't, as Bernie has decided there will be nineteen races this year.  Looks like I'll have that two month gap (between Silverstone & Spa) in my F1 viewing this summer.

Yup, the calendar is now a gaping silly design, and the BBC are amongst the losers. Again. Penfold, come visit me I will buy me some fancy HD channel for this season.

Tempting, although not for the F1.  I barely give a crap about the German or Hungarian races....


I thought I'd read some time back that Bernie was negotiating for the Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez to host a GP from 2014, but apparently the man himself has only just confirmed said talks: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/02/25/mexico-city-venue-mexican-gp-ecclestone/

Would be a welcome addition in my book.  So long as they don't dick around with the track to make it 'suitable' for modern F1.


Bernie sees potential for a 22-race calendar http://www.crash.net/f1/news/188620/1/ecclestone_still_chasing_expansion_plan.html

Teams should be able to squeeze extra cash from the F1 machine if the schedule is expanded beyond twenty, but would their personnel welcome a longer season/additional back-to-back events?

With 22 races, they might as well do 30 races and simply have two crews rotating, doing 2-3 races each and then going on vacation. 20 feels like the maximum, they do work pretty much 7 days per week from February to November.

Twenty also feels like a maximum for how many weekends per year I want to spend watching F1 - of course with BBC coverage being what it is, perhaps I should be clamouring for 40 races!

I'd not mind spending 40 Sundays per year on formula 1...

Clearly more of an F1 nut than little old me....


New Jersey organizers say no logistical problems hosting event next year, Bernie says 'show me the money': http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/03/08/new-jersey-reportedly-back-on-track-for-2014/

SO I'VE DISCOVERED AN ISSUE WITH THIS WHOLE HAVING A JOB THING. I work some Sundays, perhaps once per month. That means I will miss EVERY SINGLE RACE. Apparently. The Australian GP runs from 7am Chrill-time. Should end around 8:45am I suppose. This time I'm only so unlucky. I work from 8:45am that Sunday. I might consider "oversleeping". Or try the honest approach and ask to come in late. They wouldn't mind, the workload has decreased drastically and they don't want us there

How does working one Sunday per month make you miss every single race?

In the mean time, Cape Town/Kaapstad/iKapa decided they don't want an F1 race, which Bernie was pushing for.

Ljud; With my bad luck, my schedule will somehow warp every weekend and I will end up watching a total of 2 races this year

Here's what we use Interlagos for when Formula 1 is not around!

http://youtu.be/-lYHjaDQ1RA

Jump to 1:30 for RACE

How dare they defile the 'Senna S' with their giant delivery vans...

Bernie on again how F1 is and needs to be World (read: Asian; or who-gives-most-moneys-to-Mr.E.) championship, not European.
With Thailand and Mexico being mentioned as candidates.

I have no enthusiasm for this proposed night race round the streets of Bangkok (or for most of the existing Asian races), but perhaps Bernie's sensing an upcoming Korea-shaped gap in the schedule.  Mexico on the other hand could be a great addition, providing Tilke doesn't get his grubby little hands on any revisions to the old Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez.

http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/03/20/russia-gp-organiser-goes-bankrupt/
How are the Russians doing? We'll see.

[Penfold]

Ahh, yeah, that's got to be helpful.  Still, sounds like that Omega company has stepped in to organize the show... just a shame about the utterly uninspiring track layout.

Out of the massive 5.8 kilometre lap, only 1.1 kilometres is public road. Still, they cannot manage much. It looks like a very boring circuit with few overtaking opportunities. Maybe into turn 1.

Bernie sounding serious about the need for Interlagos to resolve its failings: http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/04/16/2013-season-finale-could-be-interlagos-last-f1-race/


Swollen costs (and possibly some dodgy construction work) in Sochi: http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2013/04/24/meanwhile-in-izvestia/


Proposed course for Thailand GP: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/04/26/thailand-grand-prix-track-route-confirmed-2015-race/

What an exciting mix of long straights and slow corners.

What an exciting array of.. bleh, that track has got to be modified.

I'm resigned to the Thailand GP circuit's layout being about as exciting as Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, or Singapore.  Look on the plus side, combine those long straights with the wonder that is DRS and we should have fifty to one hundred overtakes per race; and if that doesn't have 'guaranteed excitement' stamped all over it in giant pink font then I don't know what does.


I give my last post 7 out of 10... not a bad effort but could do so much more if he applied himself.

If Bild is to be believed, Bernie waived Nurburgring's fee to guarantee a 2013 German GP: http://grandprix247.com/2013/06/26/ecclestone-generosity-saves-german-gp-at-nurburgring/

Wouldn't be surprised if it were true as a gappy calendar is no good to anyone, but I wonder if this will be F1's last sojourn to Nurburg given the track owner's financial situation.

Upgrades to Interlagos to be finished ahead of the 2014 race. This would secure Interlagos at the F1 scene for yeaaarssss to come!

Oh, they're going to silverstone it. Well if it makes it stay in F1 I'm all for it. Better than hockenheiming it.

Well, Silverstone it as in adding a new pit complex? Sure. They are not getting rid of any of the historically famous areas though, they're just extending the second straight :p

I'm rather fond of the cheeky little turn 4 currently sat at the end of that straight and don't see why they couldn't simply replicate it on the extended section, rather than sticking in one of those tedious constant-radius corners.

Well, a constant-radius corner like that would make for a very interesting start sequence and the run up to what will now be turns 3, 4 and 5 I suppose.

Whattt!   That's my favorite corner in F1!  And now they're gonna ruin it

Technically the corner will still be there, they just won't use it for F1.   To be serious for a moment, I am actually quite annoyed that someone would casually strip the best corner from Interlagos.

Well, a constant-radius corner like that would make for a very interesting start sequence and the run up to what will now be turns 3, 4 and 5 I suppose.

I don't know, I reckon it would be fun to see the field two- or three-abreast squeeze itself through the old turn 4.


Rumour ahoy! A1-/Red Bull-Ring poised to host F1 next year: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/07/23/f1-tipped-to-return-to-austria-in-2014/

Add in Sochi & New Jersey and we're at 22 races, though either of those could suffer slippage to 2015.  Additionally, there must be a giant neon question mark hanging over the financial black hole that is the South Korean GP.

Sochi is supposedly even ahead of schedule. New Jersey is the one I carry most doubts about. Possible we will see a 21-slot calendar for next year. I'm happy to see the Red A Bull Ring 1 back

Bernie says: "Austria, yes. 20 races." Well, he probably said more than just that. The point is, there won't be any more than 20 races next year. And one of them shall be Austria. Rest, he claims, he doesn't know about yet.

Well, that'd oust South Korea and... Germany perhaps? India? China? Bahrain? God let's pray for it being Bahrain

Have been for years.  Also have my fingers crossed, a rabbit's foot in my pocket, seven four-leaf clovers hanging from a jade dreamcatcher, a wishbone in my left hand, and a horseshoe in the right.  Eating is a nightmare.

[Penfold]

Have you considered some sort of nasogastric intubation?

Who hasn't?    Sadly, the NHS doesn't consider my need to clasp lucky charms, so that I may wish Bahrain off the F1 calendar, as a qualifying medical condition.  At least not a physical one.


India GP taking a year off: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/07/30/indian-grand-prix-to-skip-a-year-in-2014/

Also, as mentioned previously, Korea's position on the calendar is looking ever less secure.  Something to do with the organizers being broke after losing tens of millions of Pounds every time they host a race.


'Singapore sling' chicane to be removed from track; or more accurately, it simply won't be plonked atop the road surface any more: http://grandprix247.com/2013/08/20/singapore-removes-unpopular-sling-chicane/

I expect to still be bored silly by the pointless little circuit.

Either way, when I read this, it was: "YES! Finally!"
I still don't like Singapore, I still consider it 2nd most boring/annoying circuit in F1 (after Bahrain), but I was raging about this non-corner since before the first race. It's not F1 if you have to drive 60 km/h or fly over or well just the idea of putting 3 90° corners inside 10 metres, or however short it is, is horrendous. And so narrow. If they wanted something stupid, they should put a bus stop a la Spa, there or something.

Yes, we must be grateful even for small mercies.

If we make a shit track this much better... its still shit. so whatever.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/109493
Mexico for the 2014 calendar? Presumably thanks to New Jersey getting the middle finger from dear Bernioso.

Nah, we're just nicely down to number 20. Unless there's another track getting dumped.

Well... If we are to believe speculation...

In:
Russia (confirmed)
New Jersey (confirmed, uncertain)
Mexico (speculated)
Austria (confirmed)

Out:
India (confirmed?)
South Korea (speculated)

If all the In and all the Out are true, we land at 21 circuits. New Jersey needs to go to make room for Mexico Bernie said this weekend that the NJ race was off.

I really do want the NJ race though, it looks like a fairly decent street track actually.

Oh, forgot about South Korea. Yes, ok, that's possible then. But we never know what will really happen.

Provisional 21-race calendar for 2014: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/09/05/mexico-in-new-jersey-out-on-21-race-2014-calendar/

India dropped and still no race in New Jersey; whilst in come Austria, Mexico, and Russia, the last two of these marked as subject to approval - as is the April-bound S. Korean GP.

I'm sad to see the New Jersey still not making it. The track seemed to be a promising one. Hopefully there will be another chance for that circuit. 2015? We've already skipped one year.

Same here.  On the other side... I'm sad to see the Sochi track make it, such an awful design.

Just hoping they don't screw around too much with the Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez.

Behold, Mr. Bernie claims the above 21-race list is NOT the provisional calendar. Basically, he's saying that such a provisional calendar does not yet exist and he most definitely didn't send it to the teams (since it doesn't exist).

Then we have a decent prankster running around posting fake calendars. Or, you know, Bernie may not be telling the whole truth to the media.

No, not our Bernie.

Some shocking news straight out of Russia has the Sochi F1 complex costing almost double the original estimate of 142 million Euros, a figure which, by the sound of it, was just plucked out of the air: http://grandprix247.com/2013/09/26/cost-of-russian-grand-prix-massively-over-budget/

Still, be it 142 million or 260 million, they've still got a fecking awful looking layout.

I could easily design a better track for less given the opportunity. Just sayin' yo.

Left-handed and with my eyes closed.


Been a few years since F1's last sojourn to Morocco, but it may be heading back that way; also news that Estoril is once again FIA certified to the highest standard; and that an F1-grade track is to be built on the outskirts of Russia, designed by none other than Hermann Tilke: http://www.f1sa.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=38124:f1--morocco-joins-formula-1-queue-estoril-approved-tilke-to-pen-moscow-track&catid=1:f1&Itemid=157

[Penfold]

I've been waiting to hear Tilke design a new track. It is the best thing that could happen to Formula 1!

Abso-bloody-lutely.  I won't be satisfied until every circuit on the calendar is a Tilke-drome.

Should message him to remake Monte-Carlo and Monza ASAP!

Yes, yes, yes!  Tilkefy the lot of them!

Someone should let him have a go at the Green Hell too. We need to modernise it.

They did it back in 80s, look what we ended up with. And then even Tilke had a go with it in 2002.

My God, I despise the current layout; same goes for Hockenheim, oh what a non-descript little circuit that has become.


Hey, you in the corner, come over here and marvel at the wondrous 2014 F1 calendar:

Mar 16 – Australia (Melbourne)
Mar 30 – Malaysia (Sepang)
Apr 6 – Bahrain (Sakhir)
Apr 20 – China (Shanghai)
May 11 – Spain (Barcelona)
May 25 – Monaco (Monte Carlo)
Jun 8 – Canada (Montreal)
Jun 22 – Austria (Red Bull Ring)
Jul 6 – Britain (Silverstone)
Jul 20 – Germany (Hockenheim)
Jul 27 – Hungary (Budapest)
Aug 24 – Belgium (Spa-Francorchamps)
Sep 7 – Italy (Monza)
Sep 21 – Singapore (Street circuit)
Oct 5 – Japan (Suzuka)
Oct 12 – Russia (Sochi)
Nov 2 – United States (Austin)
Nov 9 – Brazil (Interlagos)
Nov 23 – Abu Dhabi (Yas Marina)

There are no big surprises here. Mexico and the race just outside New York, not quite in New York but still trying to gain an advantage with a NY backdrop, are postponed to 2015 but they are both still "on".

Back-to-back from Japan to Sochi? Does not sound too great. Abu Dhabi at the very end? Stupid.

I'd have arranged the final part like this:
Italy
Russia
Singapore
Japan
Abu Dhabi
US
Brazil

But maybe the FIA don't have maps.

... or logic?


Bernie's pricing bankrupts Nurburgring, now he'll buy it: http://grandprix247.com/2014/01/16/ecclestone-makes-bid-for-historic-nurburgring/

Well, that's logical. Run them down financially, purchase the leftovers. Great success. Even if he is forced out of F1, he knows how to stay in F1.

Perhaps next he could make an offer to the cash-strapped owner of the Hungaroring, whoever that may be: http://grandprix247.com/2014/01/19/hungaroring-boss-says-money-is-needed-for-upgrades/

Red bull ring, Bernieburgring, Ecclestonering, etc.

Red bull ring, Bernieburgring, Ecclestonering, etc.

Vörösbikaring (or however you'd call it)

Red bull ring, Bernieburgring, Ecclestonering, etc.

Vörösbikaring (or however you'd call it)

What thell is a Vörösbika?

Red bull ring, Bernieburgring, Ecclestonering, etc.

Vörösbikaring (or however you'd call it)

What thell is a Vörösbika?

Any Hungarian speaker around? No? Eh.. Please? Please do confirm, that's how red bull would sound in Hungarian.

Red bull ring, Bernieburgring, Ecclestonering, etc.

Vörösbikaring (or however you'd call it)

What thell is a Vörösbika?

Any Hungarian speaker around? No? Eh.. Please? Please do confirm, that's how red bull would sound in Hungarian.

Look at all these quotes stacked up.

Bahrain is a night race. Did we tell you?

We?  Are you part of the FIA public information service... or a member of the Bahrain GP committee?

But yes, one was aware of this pointless gimmick.

[Penfold]

I was not aware of that. On the other hand, one does not follow all the ridiculous news anymore nowadays.

I post most of the ridiculous stuff on the 'Snippets' thread to help keep you (and a few others) up to speed... my apologies for failing to cover this story.


Bernie keen for future Sochi GP to be night races: http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/24/ecclestone-pushing-for-socchi-night-race/

Personally, I prefer to have sunshine glinting off race cars.

Rumours placing a Baku race (Azerbaijan) for 2015 or 2016. Looking at this street circuit in Baku.. yeah, why not? It's quite narrow with some decent straights. It'd be a different street circuit for sure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TrS1GZpoBI

Matt posted on this last week, I think it's in the 'snippets' thread.  Can't say I'm enthused by the prospect of a street race in a country with practically zero interest in motor racing - just another oily cheque for F1's owners.

While this is true, a track like that would interest me far more than some of the others we've seen recently.

I have almost zero interest in some of the recent additions so I guess you can put me in the same enthusiastic bracket.


Azerbaijan GP (though it may well be called the European GP) looks increasingly likely for 2016: http://grandprix247.com/2014/05/01/azerbaijan-set-to-announce-grand-prix-deal-for-2015/

Don't all cheer at once.

Edit: Azerbaijan race confirmed for next year: http://grandprix247.com/2014/05/08/ecclestone-confirms-azerbaijan-replacing-axed-korea-in-2015/

I don't much mind a race in Baku but does anyone have a circuit in mind yet? There's a street circuit to be used, I assume, but will it be the same used in the Baku World Challenge?

From May 26th: "Ecclestone has confirmed that Azerbaijan will hold its inaugural race in 2015 on a street circuit in Baku.

AUTOSPORT understands that the Baku track will feature only the same start-finish straight that has been used for recent sportscar races, with the rest of the layout being completely different."

Great to see Montreal secure a ten-year deal: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114327


A 2015 Baku GP doesn't interest me half as much as F1's possible return to the Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/07/22/five-year-mexican-grand-prix-deal-signed-report/


Baku GP pushed back to 2016: http://www.crash.net/f1/news/207068/1/azerbaijan-to-host-grand-prix-of-europe-in-2016.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss

Autodromo H. Rodriguez neutered to meet safety standards: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/07/24/video-reveals-planned-changes-mexicos-f1-track/

Going through the arena, then? Interesting.

If a bit concerned about Mexico.  All comments are "great to be going back to a 'real' racing track".  I'm not against it, but i'm worried that after all the changes (not just losing the Peraltada), its gonna be an anti-climax.  To be fair, whilst the esses were great to watch cars run through (like Beckets / Maggots complex at Silverstone), I don't really remember them encouraging much overtaking. 
I hope i'm wrong, cos it should be a good vibe with a great atmosphere and packed grandstands.  I'm just not sure about that stadium section.  It seems a gimmick to get more punters in.

I'm with you there.  Not sure it's possible to concoct a less inspired solution for revising the Peraltada; couldn't they chop the straights down and shift the corner into the track, thus providing ample run-off?

Not sure either. Even if, they're probably not smart enough to think of something like that.

I'm with you there.  Not sure it's possible to concoct a less inspired solution for revising the Peraltada; couldn't they chop the straights down and shift the corner into the track, thus providing ample run-off?

Afraid not.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/19%C2%B024'15.1%22N+99%C2%B005'19.5%22W/@19.404652,-99.0925102,734m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0x0?hl=en

In order to move the corner far enough to allow adequate run off they'd not just have to knock down the stadium, but also half the pit lane (in fact, the pit lane entry here is worse than Austria / Korea for cars slowing on the racing line!).  Then the oval (which I'm not even sure if its still used or not for racing - possibly lower formula) would be tiny, lol.

I was thinking that a slow chicane immediately before the Peraltada could help, cos then you would only be entering the corner at 70mph and not at 150mph.  It would then be a corner that you accelerate through rather than have to brake for (kinda like turn 3 at Sepang - struggling to find a better example, but you know what I mean - less Parabolica, more Curva Grande).

The oval is used in NASCAR

Indeed: http://www.nascarmexico.com.mx/v8/calendario/

Although when one of the major NASCAR series went to Mexico, they actually raced on the road course.

Are the pits even up to F1 standard?  Time to demolish and rebuild further down the straight; the same goes for the inner section of oval.  Yes, those two inward-facing stands would have to go, but do they want to be an F1 circuit or a music venue? 

I was thinking that a slow chicane immediately before the Peraltada could help, cos then you would only be entering the corner at 70mph and not at 150mph

Preferable to the stadium idea (although still strips the track of its defining feature), and at least run-off would be relatively easy to add round the second half of the corner, but who knows if the FIA would be satisfied with available space at the Peraltada's mid-point; or even with the corner being blind courtesy of that stand.

[Penfold]

Good to see Melbourne extend hosting duties out to 2020 - and that they'll be day races.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-03/australian-grand-prix-to-stay-in-melbourne-until-2020/5644162

Part of the F1 experience after a winter of waiting is getting up early for the Australian GP premiere. It's essential!! I'm glad to see it extended.

In response to earlier concerns of the redesign of Interlagos, we can breathe a sigh of relief. The new pits will be built but simply over the existing ones. The circuit appears to be remaining the same.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/115292

I'd forgotten plans were afoot to screw with Interlagos.  Glad to see it's just getting a spruce-up instead.


Utterly insignificant when we've got Bianchi in critical condition, but the Baku GP course has been confirmed: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/10/07/azerbaijan-street-circuit-layout-2016-european-grand-prix-revealed/

Right-angle corners are the best....

..I quite like the Baku circuit. I know the eastern part looks boring but the western section looks pretty fine. It's definitely built for two DRS zones but that's the best we can expect really.

Time to free up some space on the old F1 calendar as both India & Qatar shoot for a GP in 2017: http://www.grandprix247.com/2014/11/12/india-targeting-grand-prix-return-by-2017/ and Qatar: http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/exclusive-qatar-poised-to-join-f1-calendar

Bahrain, Abu Dhabi, Qatar... always great to see F1 expanding its geographical spread.  Perhaps Dubai next?

Dubai, Abu Dhabi... They're both part of UAE. Then again, that would not be an obstacle. Street race in Dubai, do it. We have a topic.

Hmm, perhaps two in the UAE is pushing things.  We'll just have to settle for three races on that small section of the Arabian Peninsula - unless Saudi Arabia wants in.


Qatar GP looking a done deal as bidders set to exploit Bernie's one weakness: http://www.grandprix247.com/2014/11/25/qatar-prepared-to-pay-78-million-for-2017-grand-prix/

Then there's the slightly less likely scenario of the Danes hosting a race: http://www.grandprix247.com/2014/11/26/denmark-wants-to-host-grand-prix-in-2018/

Back again to pondering which current tracks will get the old heave-ho, assuming twenty races remains the limit.  Mexico to fill the last empty slot next year, so then it's lose one to accommodate Azerbaijan in 2016 (Austria seems a likely candidate) and another for Qatar in '17... but who?

Singapore has been rumoured to go a few times. The Germans might not afford to. China? Bahrain? This if wishful thinking, these last two.

Think we're stuck with Bahrain (money!) and I doubt Bernie wants to lose China from the calendar.  Germany was one I had in mind, what with the organisers (at both of the tedious tracks) being constantly on the verge of bankruptcy.


Under a deal with Bernie, the Bahrainis have final say on any new Persian Gulf races and they don't seem minded to let Qatar into the club: http://www.grandprix247.com/2015/01/13/bahrain-says-no-to-qatar-street-race/

Hockenheim instead of Nurburgring this year: http://www.grandprix247.com/2015/01/15/2015-german-gp-at-hockenheim-not-nurburgring/

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2015/06/16/f1-fanatic-round-up-1606-2/
Imola looking to replace Monza if Monza does not pull through.

In a perfect world, I would want both tracks. In a less than perfect world, Imola would never be able to match Monza. Imola is still a good track but it lacks the character it once had. Monza is the mother of characteristic circuits.

Losing marvellous Monza... another nail in F1's coffin.  Or we might only lose it half of the time, the circuit alternating with Imola to keep the sport in Italy: http://www.grandprix247.com/2015/06/18/ecclestone-confirms-imola-monza-alternation-option/

Well, it certainly worked fine for the German GP.

quote author=Penfold]
Well, it certainly worked fine for the German GP.

[/quote]

Bernie saying there's no good track in France, so definitely no GP there. Funny, I find Magny-Cours pretty interesting, but ok, it's in the middle of nowhere, Bernie hates that. But maybe he forgot about his own circuit? Then again, he wouldn't earn anything if he had to pay to himself to host the race...?

Yeah, I always thought Magny-Cours had a good flow to it; perhaps they should've had Tilke produce an exact replica in the desert of some oil-rich nation rather than letting him loose on a blank sheet of paper.

Yeah, I always thought Magny-Cours had a good flow to it; perhaps they should've had Tilke produce an exact replica in the desert of some oil-rich nation rather than letting him loose on a blank sheet of paper.

The sad/funny part of this is that it would be one of his better creations.

Really doubt it would happen, but some Dutch politicians are keen on getting F1 back to Zandvoort: http://planetf1.com/news/zandvoort-interested-in-f1-return/

[Penfold]

Take a look at this rendering of a narrow section of the Baku GP circuit:

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/turn-9-10-baku-5-reup.jpg

And I thought Rio in Forza 6 was bad...

I can predict a neat pile-up with a resulting red flag. Are they really going to let Maldonado drive there?

Some new details on Baku: expected average speed, top speed, track width, stuff like that:  http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/01/27/baku-slow-lap-high-top-speed-and-very-narrow/

Good (normal) overtaking opportunity into turn one; doubtless to be ruined with DRS and its impossible-to-defend-against speed differentials.

Yeah, that front straight is nasty long. I quite like the narrower sections around corners 8-11 (the ones I highlighted above too!). This track is surely more unique than other new tracks, but it probably won't be... great.

Fortunately for it we have many tracks that fall well short of greatness....


Monza modification plan sees first chicane killed off and a new section supplanting Curva Grande: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/05/24/monza-planning-tear-first-chicane/


Austrian track could have its old 'west loop' reconnected for 2017: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125068

Imola moving closer to hosting the 2017 Italian GP. They've signed a deal with Bernie Ecclestone. It will only be valid if the Italian government approves the switch from Monza to Imola, so Bernie hasn't signed his own contract yet. Still, interesting development since Monza is going ever deeper into financial problems.

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/imola-signs-agreement-with-ecclestone-for-italian-gp-798879/?s=1

Love both tracks but hard to picture F1 without Monza - guessing their financial woes kill off the circuit rejig plans mentioned a couple of posts back.

Not necessarily. Abandoning F1 (at least for now) might actually save Monza. It would free up money to make the modifications for the track and make it suit MotoGP. That's not a bad race to host either.

Speaking of which, FINLAND is getting a MotoGP race for 2018. We haven't had a major motorsport event in Scandinavia since the 70s when Sweden hosted F1.

Has F1 been costing Monza money during its current, soon to expire, cut-price deal?  The problem is agreeing a new contract when it seems Bernie wants to squeeze the owners for $8 million more per annum than they're prepared/able to pay.

I believe so, yes. Which is what this whole negotiation is about. The Italian government needs to increase funding by quite a bit for Monza to continue.

2017 German Grand Prix? Probably not. Hockenheim has a contract to host it 2014, 2016, and 2018. Nürburgring have already abandoned the contract they had for 2015 and 2017. Hockenheim is not very likely to step in.

IN COMES A THIRD OPTION. Sachsenring:
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns34532.html

But here is what the track chief of Sahcsenring says about that:
http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/german-grand-prix/news/boss-plays-down-sachsenring-rumours_277935.html

It's also short and I don't see a lot of passing opportunities.

Yes. It's definitely more suited for MotoGP than F1. Such a short lap would give us laptimes of less than A1/Österreich/Red Bull ring.

I don't actually have a problem with short tracks. It makes no difference how many laps there are if the track produces good racing, and the shorter lap is better for people at the track. That layout doesn't look like it would produce good racing though, that's the bigger problem.

I would rather not German GP next year than the Sahcsenring. I can't see it offering a good race. The whole of sector 2 would be single file.  I prefer quality over quantity, so would rather that they focus on getting Hockenheim sorted every 2 years. There is no reason why somewhere like France (or even Imola) couldn't get a race every 2 years to alternate with Germany.  Variety would keep things interesting and help places that can't afford a race every year.

Off topic, but in my head it's pronounced "Saxon ring" and is far more brutal!

I don't actually have a problem with short tracks. It makes no difference how many laps there are if the track produces good racing, and the shorter lap is better for people at the track. That layout doesn't look like it would produce good racing though, that's the bigger problem.

Well, I believe F1 has a track distance minimum of 4.3 km with Monaco the only exception since it is so slow. See Red Bull Ring, Hermanos Rodriguez, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, and Interlagos for example. They're all just a few meters longer than 4.3km. Sachsenring is definitely shorter than 4.3km.

On a related note, the longest ever F1 circuit was the Pescara Circuit at 25.8km which is 3 kilometers longer than the Nordschleife at Nürburgring and 3.5 times longer than modern-day Spa!

Got some people down on the Algarve eyeing up an F1 race: http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/10/03/portugal-have-f1-proposal-for-garnd-prix-in-algarve/

God only knows how they'd scrape together Bernie's hosting fee....

[Penfold]

Algarve looks a little bit like Catalunya. Perhaps great to drive, but not good for overtaking.

Possible new track for Russia - no prizes for guessing the designer: http://www.globalconstructionreview.com/news/russia-considers-formula-1-cir7uit-s7t-petersb7urg/

Could it be Mr. Tilke?

Wallop.  Straight in with the right answer.  Don't know how you did it.

But as stated no prize....

Sepang, Malaysia, claiming that the number of races in Asia has made life difficult, may not sign a contract extension after their current deal expires in 2018. That's two more races in Malaysia before we go bye bye.
http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/10/26/malaysian-grand-prix-will-happen-for-two-more-years/

Cynic in me wonders if these are the sorts of noises one might make as part of a negotiating strategy for any deal to extend their contract.

Definitely, but the Malaysian GP has been struggling for a while. If Bernie is still running negotiations in 2018, I could see them folding.

Malaysia won't extend F1 contract beyond 2018.  So it wasn't all just a cunning negotiating ploy: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/11/21/malaysia-will-not-extend-f1-contract-minister-confirms/

Malaysia and Singapore may both go.

Let's replace them with classics. Imola for example.

Would be great but can't see that keeping Liberty's money men happy.

I see Germany is doubtful for 2017 unless they can agree another cut-price deal with Bernie/his new boss. 


New contract for Monza: http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/11/29/monza-signs-new-three-year-grand-prix-contract/


BRDC Board writes to members warning of "potentially ruinous risk" of Silverstone continuing to host F1 races; states it is considering triggering a break clause which would end their contract with FOM in 2019, a full seven years early: http://www.itv.com/news/2017-01-05/future-of-british-grand-prix-at-silverstone-at-risk-over-potentially-ruinous-costs/

And Bernie says "I don't care. I have interest from two other possible sites to take over the British GP".

Typical load of old bollocks from Bernie.  As the BRDC is itself fully aware, there are no realistic alternatives to Silverstone: https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/jan/06/silverstone-alternatives-f1-british-grand-prix-ecclestone

I would guess that perhaps a Grand Prix of London could be on the cards. They do seem keen on that.

Silverstone packs in more paying punters than any London street race could manage, so given that the Northamptonshire circuit loses money when hosting F1 the question has to be who picks up the tab for a race in the capital?  I can't picture the current Mayor of London stumping up millions each year for the privilege of closing off a section of London to make room for a (small) bunch of loud, CO2 spewing F1 cars.

Yeah. That khan bloke is busy promising no public transport strikes will occur, then watching such a strike occur. Poor boy.

Liberty (says it) wants to keep Silverstone on the calendar but won't budge on the 'potentially ruinous' hosting fees; but don't fear, because this is what they will do: "With Silverstone, we want to help them promote the race. When there is an NFL game in London, the shops in Regent Street are full of it. We want to do that sort of thing with the British Grand Prix and also make the event broader, with the race at the centre of a full weekend show."

Of course, that's what the British GP has been missing all these years: public awareness of the event.  Get some flashy promotion going and they'll be raking in the cash with sell-out crowds... oh crap, what do you mean they already attract capacity crowds of 140,000?  But then how is Liberty's plan anything more than useless noise?


Russian Govt. steps back from funding GP, expects a group of private companies to pick up the slack: http://en.f1i.com/news/88845-future-russian-gp-hands-private-investors.html

Announcing your new Russian GP investor: The Trump Organization!

[Penfold]

Sydney angling for Aussie GP, Melbourne officials say:
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/motor-sport/formula-one/australian-grand-prix-new-formula-one-boss-opens-door-to-sydney-bid-to-hijack-event/news-story/dc6e6286e8705d3be3b3e938a30125f6

Several Aussies commenting on following site not sounding keen about such a switch: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/02/16/f1-fanatic-round-up-1602-2/

I'd prefer if the Trumps could be persuaded to buy Silverstone, because God knows nobody else wants to....


Canada & Russia each add five years to their F1 contracts: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/03/01/canadian-grand-prix-deal-extended-to-2029/


Now, did I need to copy all the old posts of this thread... not really; but there are a fairly small number of topics that will get any such attention so figured I may as well keep them in their entirety - except the 'snippets thread', way, way too big.

[Penfold]

Peeps at Zandvoort commissioned a feasibility study into whether the economics of hosting an F1 race stack up: http://en.f1i.com/news/260155-zandvoort-studying-return-dutch-gp.html

Let me briefly ponder that very question....

Took a few seconds but I think I have the answer: No.

[Chrill]

It can be viable if the Dutch government step in. Max Attack is a bit of a national icon.